[00:00:00]
Genecia Alluora: How you establish the rapport and relationship with your children?

[00:00:03]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: For me when I interact with my children It's more like friends interacting with each other. We talk about different things different ideas, hashtag unfiltered. Even though this may sound impossible but we have a very open conversation about things.

[00:00:22]
Genecia Alluora: How do you maintain that spark in your relationship?

[00:00:26]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Okay, it's very simple. It's just acknowledging that he's the smarter one.

[00:00:30]
Genecia Alluora: A strong and independent woman is something to behold. She pays her own bills, buys her own things, and she doesn't let a man affect her stability or self-confidence. She is a Soul Rich Woman. Are you ready to be rich, doing what you love? Be on purpose and in control of your life again. And For Women Who Love the F-word Podcast, we will be openly talking about getting more clients online, getting recognition as the leader and female entrepreneur, and also the F word. Being fabulous, having freedom and financial independence. It's time to own and love the F word. Welcome to the show.

[00:01:16]
Genecia Alluora: Hello and welcome to today's episode. Today we have Dr. Yong Hsin Ning with us. She has 20 years of management consulting experience. Predominantly in the field of business transformation Business, process re-engineering, change management, and learning and performance support. She has worked with clients from across both public and private sector in the defence industrial relations, consumer goods, telecommunications and airline industries. She is currently the co-founder and director of Change Voyage Consulting. A boutique consulting firm which provides tailored solutions in the areas of organizational and business development, and individual change.

[00:02:03]
Genecia Alluora: She is also an adjunct faculty at the Lee Kong Chin School of Business in the Singapore Management University. She has obtained a PhD from SMU. Her dissertation topic centres around how part-time employees manage non-work time to reduce the tendency to work overtime. Dr. Yong, otherwise known dearly to us as Hsin Ning. You will hear me addressing her as Hsin Ning because she is my coaching client to help her how to go from offline to online. I love her so much great knowledge and she has so much to share. So I hope you enjoy this episode.

[00:02:46]
Genecia Alluora: My name is Genecia Alluora and today on the show we have a really special guest with us. She is this super special person that loves to change, change people, change organisation and she always say that she is the glue. I wonder what glue is that. The wuhu glue or the what glue. So we are going to find out exactly what exactly she do today. Hello Hsin Ning, welcome to the show.

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Thanks Genecia, thanks for having me on.

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Genecia Alluora: So what glue is it?

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: I always have difficulty trying to explain what I do to other people. So I realised that using the glue analogy not wuhu glue is something that resonates with people. So imagine your organisation is going through a change. So it may be new system, new performance appraisal, new proposal system, merger acquisition, etc. But at first people are all thinking about the change in different ways. The senior management, the end users, even the people who comes in to do the project. They are all in a space of themselves. So what our company does is that we go in and we try to glue them all together. For what? So that they can move towards the goal in a concerted manner.

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: They can move together but I also don't want to be the glue for too long. Okay. What I want to do is that I hope that one day they will be able to produce their own glue. And they will then glue themselves together to move towards the goal that they want to do. So essentially that's what I do for a living.

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Genecia Alluora: And that would mean change management, right?

[00:04:22]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Exactly.

[00:04:23]
Genecia Alluora: Yeah, so something that you help a team of people, a group of individuals to come together and be able to what? I say kind of find the right jigsaw puzzle pieces? Whether you are round or square but you try to fit everybody together so eventually the full jigsaw puzzle image is being formed.

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Exactly.

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Genecia Alluora: Yeah, so I think that's very interesting. So when I look at your profile you know you are a mother. You know you are academic. You are a researcher. You do so many things plus you are a female entrepreneur. How do you juggle and manage your time?

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So one thing at a time, firstly. Secondly, telling myself it's possible. So a lot of times we are constrained by our paradigm and constrained by what other people tell us that we can or cannot do. So if we want to just dissect and peel the onion and think about critically, how do I fit things in? How do I reorganise my time to make things possible? It can be done.

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Genecia Alluora: And how exactly do you do that? Share two strategies.

[00:05:32]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So there are two strategies in which I try to juggle between all the various pieces. The first strategy is better optimisation of my time. So for me a lot of times I spend working either very early in the morning where there is no disruption. And before I go to work. And also during times where I'm waiting for my kids to come off their enrichment class. So for the fact that I can finish my research I must give credits to McDonald's because they've allowed me to sit there for a very long duration of time. The second strategy is to leverage on other people to collaborate with you to be able to juggle. So for example when I did my dissertation I had to be away from the office for a long period of time. Sometimes for a whole week from Monday to Saturday.

[00:06:23]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: And I had to work closely with my clients and my team members to be able to continue the work even though I was not around. So it may seem impossible in the first place because that's something that's outside of our comfort zone. We're used to just being there all the time to deal with all problems that come but if there is a will there's a way. And you will be able to overcome the difficulties if you just put your mind to it.

[00:06:50]
Genecia Alluora: I know that you teach in Universities and when you shared with me when we were doing the coaching sessions I can feel that passion that goes on behind that. And you always tell me how you're going to improve and help your learners to learn better. So I'm just very curious what really makes you tick that keeps that passion going?

[00:07:13]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So for me my passion is in creating knowledge as well as delivering knowledge to people. So the part that keeps me going is to understand how do I make something so simple that it is very very easy for the students to consume. So the topic that I teach is around business model design and for students who haven't been outside into the real world and they need to deal with real clients is really a tall order. So it's almost like describing a colour that you have not seen before. So how do I simplify the complex? To make something that seems so insurmountable to be something that's really within the comfort zone of the students. Is a challenge that I pose to myself and that's what makes me tick.

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Genecia Alluora: Okay and you know when we talk about all this female entrepreneurship thing I mean you didn't start like that you were in the corporate world for many many years. Right? How many years was that?

[00:08:23]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Probably close to 20.

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Genecia Alluora: So share a little bit about that journey that you went on. The last part where you were thinking about whether to stay or to pursue the next level of the corporate world. Could you share with us your progression? And then your struggles and eventually your end decision.

[00:08:46]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So I was about 40 years old when I hit a roadblock in my career. So at that point in time it was just endless juggling with work and with my family. I have my two children who were very young then. And I remember every time during the journey out to work I would always have this voice speaking in my head. I wish I could quit and very quickly there was another voice that came out in response to that voice which says, why not? So the list was very long in the beginning but as a very structured person I tried to cross out the list one by one to clear the hurdles of. To justify or clear the hurdles in terms of why I should or should not quit. But after a while I realised that I was holding myself hostage.

[00:09:43]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Fear was holding me hostage because I was concerned about loss of financial comfort. I was fearful of the loss of professional stature. Because I was somebody and if I left I would become nobody. So after quite a long struggle I decided to set myself free. So what do I mean by setting yourself free? There is a book, my favourite book which is called Hostage at the Table and it's written by an ex-police officer. I believe his name is called George Corizer. So what he said is that in a hostage situation you need to understand the needs and wants of the hostage in order to satisfy and establish a bond between the hostage. So for me the person who is taking hostage of myself is me and therefore I have to come to terms with the fear. And also come to terms with how do I overcome the challenges.

[00:10:46]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So eventually I come to terms with that and even on the day that I left I did not have a clear idea of what I wanted to do. But I had convinced myself enough that I wanted to take on the challenge and I was game to learn new things. And to live in some form of ambiguity.

[00:11:10]
Genecia Alluora: And therefore you took the step forward to quit the job?

[00:11:14]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So I took the step forward and the first thing that I did was to take on a PhD course.

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Genecia Alluora: So it was not like you immediately you quit, immediately you started the company?

[00:11:28]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Oh, no, no, no. So there was a period of ambiguity I liked knowledge creation and knowledge dissemination. So I thought doing a part-time PhD course would be something that would do me some good. I still remember at the interview. So we had to go through an interview at the, before we were selected for the PhD programme. And I remembered the programme director Dr. Zee asked me. So, Hsin Ning can you tell me why do you want to be doing the PhD course? And I said, oh, I love to write. I love to create knowledge. Then he said we're going to write a book. Go and write a book. Why PhD course? So at the end of the day I just said, Oh, well I'm vain. I want a doctor in front of me. Well that is not too far fetched from the truth because at that point in time I did not have a very clear idea of what I wanted to do with my professional career.

[00:12:31]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: And I was just taking things one step at a time. And with that mentality I'm glad I took that step because it has led me on to think about how differently I wanted to deliver change management services for my clients. And I was exposed to a network of people that I would have never been able to be exposed to Entrepreneurs, CEOs, Founders of companies who gave me very different insights from what I would have gotten if I were to stay as an employee.

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Genecia Alluora: And by doing your PhD you mentioned about the network, right? So let's talk about you are the average of the six people that you hang out with the most. And your network equals to your net worth. So how has that to a certain extent even though you have now finally achieved your PhD helped you with this network, helped you in the business that you are doing now?

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: There are two ways that it has helped as I mentioned just now. The first way that it has helped me is that these people helped me to think about things very differently. So my favourite quote is from Dr. Dwayne Geyer. If you change the way you think about things, the way you look at things. The things that you look at change. So because of the people that is in my new network, my classmates and my fellow course mates. The way that they think about problems are very different from how I would approach them. And this gives me inspiration to do things differently. Even going the way that we go to market for example. So I remembered my course mates asking me, so Hsin Ning, so what do you sell? So what do you sell? I'm like, change management services. How else can you describe change management services?

[00:14:31]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: But after despite my best effort to describe change management services to them for the last 30 minutes they still came back to ask me, so what exactly do you sell? So that's when I realised that the way that I think about change management services and how people think about it as well as want to consume it is very different. So that's one. The second thing that they have helped me in my business is of course connecting me to people who can give me the opportunity to serve them. So because their network is very vast and varied this has also exposed me to a lot more opportunities in terms of my business.

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Genecia Alluora: So how would you describe that to someone who is completely new to you. And want to know more how you can help them?

[00:15:22]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: How do you get your entire team or entire organisation to move towards a goal in a concerted and integrated fashion. Everybody thinking the same. Everybody aligned to the vision. Everybody geared up to reach to the goal. That is the goal and objective of change management.

[00:15:41]
Genecia Alluora: Very good. And I love that you are someone who is never giving up. Always keep learning and keep developing your mind. You have so many facets of you. You wear so many different hats. I'm just curious about your relationship with your children and how do you when you say that you communicate with them. How do you do that part?

[00:16:01]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So for me I take a step back and talk about my own upbringing and how that affects how I impart my values to my children. As I was growing up my parents being teachers themselves are disciplinarians. So there was no concept of being friends with your children. It was very very alien to them. And a lot of times I feel that I knew the facts but I was not really independent in terms of how I made my own decisions. So as I grew up into an adult I thought that because of the dynamic world environment, it's very important for our children to learn how to think for themselves. Because I may not be there all the time. My husband may not be there all the time. And even at a very young age they need to be there to stand up, think for themselves and have a point of view about things.

[00:17:03]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So for me when I interact with my children it's more like friends interacting with each other. We talk about different things. Different ideas. Hashtag unfiltered. Even though this may sound impossible but we have a very open conversation about things.

[00:17:24]
Genecia Alluora: So that's how you establish the rapport and relationship with your children. How about your husband? How do you maintain that spark in your relationship?

[00:17:33]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: It's very simple. It's just acknowledging that he's the smarter one.

[00:17:37]
Genecia Alluora: Okay.

[00:17:38]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: I think for me and my husband. We are joined with a common passion for learning. So we always take a lot of joy in exchanging the new things that we learn. Granted we may not always have the common interest but we always enjoy sharing with each other what we have learned. And we, it's almost like pacing each other in a marathon. So it's like relationship and marriage is long term for us. So to have a pacer is very important and to me that is one of the key contributing factors of the spark being alive in our relationship.

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Genecia Alluora: I love that. What do you think is a Soul Rich Woman?

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Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So when I first saw Soul Rich Woman, I thought it was a fantastic name. Because initially when we looked at the label it looks like it's about richness. It's about getting more money. But after looking at the collaterals. After going through the coaching. And after talking with Genecia I have a very, very different point of view. There is a soul and there's a rich. The rich is to enable you to have a soul. So what do I mean by that? So in business coaching and business mentoring it's about accumulation of wealth. It's about thinking about how do you do you scale and grow and get more cash flow and get more money.

[00:19:12]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: At the end of the day what are we using that for? We are using that to find our soul and to do things that is meaningful to us. And can make a difference to other people. So I think that Soul Rich Woman as an enterprise actually enables women to do both which I think is fantastic.

[00:19:36]
Genecia Alluora: Of the F word. You know we talked about the three F words. Which one is your favourite F word?

[00:19:42]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Definitely freedom.

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Genecia Alluora: Tell us more.

[00:19:45]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So the reason why I started this company with basically my co-founder is precisely because of the F word freedom. So freedom to be able to deliver what we consider the best service and the best value to our clients without the constraints of typically larger setups. And secondly freedom and flexibility. To decide where and how I want to use my time and that's very important to me at my stage of life now.

[00:20:15]
Genecia Alluora: Any parting or last advice that you would give to our women in the community who is just sitting on the fence. Maybe deciding to see the next career progression or maybe to jump over like what you did either to go into a PhD or to even start their business. What would you share with them?

[00:20:35]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: So let me give you two things two words. Why not? So think about what is stopping you from taking the next step. Be truthful to yourself and answer the questions that come from within. Ask yourself, Why not? Are you being held hostage by fear? Are you being held hostage by the unknown? Because if you are then you need to. You need to come to terms with that and move the first step forward.

[00:21:09]
Genecia Alluora: Okay, so good. And last but not least. What is your favourite quote?

[00:21:13]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: My favourite quote is by Dr. Dane Dyer and it's if you change the way that you look at things, the things that you look at will change.

[00:21:24]
Genecia Alluora: Where can our audience reach you?

[00:21:24]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Okay you can reach me via our website www.changevoyage.com or via LinkedIn and it's Yong Hsin Ning.

[00:21:32]
Genecia Alluora: Alright. So thank you very much for your time today, Hsin Ning.

[00:21:36]
Dr. Yong Hsin Ning: Thank you, Genecia. Thank you for having me.

[00:21:38]
Genecia Alluora: Well that's all for today on Soul Rich Woman TV For women who love the F word. Being fabulous Having freedom And financial independence. This is Genecia Alluora signing off. Bye for now. Bye.

[00:21:52]
Genecia Alluora: Thank you so much for joining me today. I'm so honored that we are connected and I hope that I can continue to serve you as you build your dreams. And if you love this episode, and I hope that you did, please share it with your friends and family. This has been a Rated Five star show. Give us that glowing review because it will helping more women around the world finding the Soul Rich Woman podcast. Alone you are strong, together we are unstoppable. Now share this with every woman who needs it because this is how we are changing the world one woman at a time. As always, get out of your comfort zone and go towards the dreams you always wanted to achieve. For women who love the F word, being fabulous, having freedom and financial independence. My dear soul rich woman, sending you my love and I'll speak to you soon. Bye for now.